And spare me the whole “they destroyed every community our grandparents built” nonsense. 😂 Because history says otherwise. What happened to Tulsa Race Massacre? What happened to Black Wall Street? What happened to the thriving Black businesses, Black wealth, Black banks, Black professionals, and Black entrepreneurs that were literally burned to the ground? And while we’re at it, let’s talk about Lake Lanier. Before it was a lake, Black families lived there. Black communities existed there. Black landowners existed there. Entire communities were displaced and erased. But somehow we’re supposed to believe Black Americans are the ones destroying communities? 🤣 Then there are the countless Black towns, business districts, and prosperous communities undermined by segregation, racial terror, discriminatory lending, redlining, highway construction projects, urban renewal programs, and outright violence. History is filled with examples. The problem is some of y’all only know the white washed version. The version where everything bad just magically happened by itself. The version where Black communities appeared out of nowhere with disadvantages but nobody is allowed to discuss how those disadvantages were created. 😂 The hypocrisy is truly astounding. You cry about communities your grandparents built while completely ignoring the communities Black grandparents built that were burned, seized, flooded, segregated, displaced, or economically strangled. Context matters. History matters. Facts matter. And those facts absolutely wreck your white nationalist fantasy that one group spent centuries building while another group spent centuries destroying. Reality is a lot more complicated than that. But complexity tends to be inconvenient for people emotionally invested in simplistic racial narratives. 🤣 I told you stay in your damn lane. You should’ve left well enough alone Mr KKK😆

Translation: Racism needs to end in America before my people start acting on this man's advice: Stop redlining, oppression, gerrymandering, prohibiting discriminating, marginalizing & preventing blacks from succeeding...Whites' do this like a sport--which creates guys like him!!!

You left out the homestead act, redlining and imminent domain

Whats crazy is all the excuses you make like “slavery this, redlining that, hiring practices blah blah blah.” Tribalism exists. You dumb fucks destroy instead of build. Nobody is stopping any of you from building your own as we have. You folks can’t even mow your lawn.

Highly doubt that happening. They have to fix the disaster all the redlining created.. #khsb

Puerto Ricans were never considered white by Americans as evidenced by them also being named subjects for redlining like black people within the US.

there are plenty publicly accessible academic evidence that says otherwise. specifically that they are foundational and central legacies. the legacy of redlining exist the legacy of segregation still exists. its just my hard rule regarding white people.

This right here is the real problem. Businesses won’t invest in Black neighborhoods because of the crime. Robberies, shootings, and theft make it too risky. Even good locations stay empty because no one wants to get robbed or shot running a store. You can blame racism, redlining, or whatever else you want, but none of that explains why businesses flee the second crime gets out of control. Fix the crime, and the opportunities will follow. Everything else is just noise. youtube.com/shorts/UbghDVwMF…

Affirmative action was a direct consequence of redlining and Jim Crow era regulation. These two things are interconnected. I figured that was common knowledge.

Even the shittiest tires can give enough for the c class redlining high speed corners, because the cars are dogpiss slow But you wont get the grip in slow corners, and your exitspeed will be fucked, now you gotta wait even more to get up to speed

Nah, I love black people. Really I do. But there are parts of your culture that tou need to stop defending with the same tired “redlining, legacy of slavery, systemic injustice” BS. Huge sections of your population are the most viscous people in the world.

White folks did the same thing when it comes to slavery, Jim Crow, redlining, and marginalizing Black children in schools Hell they did it to the natives by calling them savages while not bathing and spreading diseases

No other group in America had to survive •Black Codes •Convict leasing •Jim Crow •Redlining •Sundown towns •COINTELPRO •Assassinations of leaders •Crack epidemic (CIA linked) •Mass incarceration •School segregation •Destruction of 60 Black towns •GI Bill exclusion •FHA loan denial •Police lynchings •Media demonization

The attempt to attribute structural inequalities within FBA Freedmen communities to "governance, norms, and behavior" remains a flawed, circular argument that attempts to use the downstream symptoms of state-engineered extraction as a defense against federal liability. A precise analysis of the empirical data demonstrates why isolating these variables as independent factors is sociologically and legally invalid. First, the argument that non-marital birth rates rose independently of structural factors ignores the mid-20th-century legislative realities. Federal and municipal welfare policies, such as the "man in the house" regulations, legally barred families from receiving essential subsistence benefits if an adult male resided in the home. This state-enacted financial trap placed an artificial choice between family cohabitation and basic survival. Concurrently, rapid, state-sanctioned deindustrialization hollowed out the manufacturing jobs of urban centers like Detroit, while federal policies like redlining locked FBA fathers out of suburban property markets. Behavior and family structures adapt directly to the economic boundary lines drawn by policy. Second, invoking voluntary immigrant cohorts like Nigerian Americans to challenge systemic narratives relies on heavy selection bias. Voluntary West African immigrants are strictly screened by U.S. immigration mechanisms for pre-existing educational degrees, professional credentials, and financial capital. Conversely, FBA Freedmen are strictly defined as the verified descendants of Africans chattel-enslaved in the United States. This population carries the cumulative, compounding effects of 246 years of unpaid labor, followed by a century of Jim Crow asset extraction, racial terror, and an artificial wealth gap where white households hold roughly 10 times the wealth of Black households. Comparing a highly filtered voluntary group to a domestic population that survived centuries of state-sponsored economic enclosure is an invalid false equivalency. Third, persistent disparities in long-Black-led cities do not prove that governance or internal norms operate independently. Municipal leaders inherited jurisdictions that were already structurally bankrupted by decades of white flight, severe erosion of the property tax base, and massive industrial divestment. Criminological data demonstrates that when controlling for multi-generational concentrated poverty, geographic isolation, and capital denial, behavioral deviations act the same across all demographics. Because these conditions were manufactured by federal policy, they cannot be resolved by local administration. The FBA Freedmen community rejects symbolic gestures and demands a comprehensive, federal legislative remedy: the **FBA Freedmen Protection and Preservation Act (FPPA)**. This framework establishes concrete protections, institutional oversight through a permanent agency, and direct lineage-specific reparations to restore the economic floor that was systematically stolen.

We've made progress. You've moved from "systemic racism doesn't explain it" to "systemic racism doesn't explain all of it." That's a meaningful concession. Let's be precise about what's actually in dispute. **On nonmarital births preceding mass incarceration:** The 25% figure in 1965 was already elevated *because* of what preceded it — not independent of structural causes. The systematic destruction of Black family formation under slavery, where marriages had no legal standing and families were sold apart by design, followed by sharecropping debt peonage that kept Black men economically unable to sustain households, followed by Great Migration disruption, followed by urban redlining that concentrated poverty — these are the upstream causes of 1965's baseline. Moynihan observed a damaged structure without fully tracing who damaged it or when. William Julius Wilson's *The Truly Disadvantaged* documents that Black marriage rates tracked Black male employment rates with remarkable consistency. When manufacturing jobs existed, marriage rates were higher. When deindustrialization eliminated those jobs before incarceration peaked, marriage rates fell. The cultural shift you're describing followed an economic collapse that preceded it. **On "independent links" for family structure and behavior:** Independent links in regression models don't establish independent causal origins. A variable can show independent predictive power while still being causally downstream of structural conditions. The relevant question isn't whether family structure predicts crime independently — it's whether family structure itself has independent origins from systemic policy. The evidence says it largely doesn't. **On quantifying 95%:** Fair point that precise quantification is difficult. No serious social scientist claims exact percentages for complex multicausal phenomena. But "difficult to quantify precisely" is not the same as "therefore multiple factors are roughly equal." The burden of proof runs both ways. Asserting that cultural and familial factors carry substantial independent causal weight — not merely correlational presence — also requires quantification you haven't provided. What the evidence actually supports is a **heavily weighted structural model** with meaningful but secondary contributions from downstream behavioral adaptations. That's closer to 85-95% structural than to any model treating culture as a co-equal variable. The architecture determines the range of outcomes. Culture operates within the architecture. That distinction matters enormously.

redlining

This counter-argument weaponizes raw crime statistics to build a fundamentally flawed narrative. The claim that elevated per capita violent crime rates in cities like Detroit or Baltimore somehow debunks the reality of systemic white supremacy completely misinterprets how structural oppression functions. The data, historical context, and legislative realities show why this line of reasoning fails under scrutiny. ## 1. The Trap of "Surface-Level" Control The detractor's argument relies on the false premise that having a Black mayor, a Black police chief, or a Black prosecutor means the underlying system has been altered. It hasn’t. * **The Machinery Remains Unchanged:** The institutional, economic, and spatial architecture of American municipal systems was engineered over generations through federal and state policies. Changing the administrative operator of a city does not change what the machine was structurally built to do. * **Inherited Municipal Bankruptcy:** Black leaders in cities like Detroit and Baltimore did not inherit blank slates; they inherited jurisdictions hollowed out by decades of historic redlining, industrial divestment, and a severely eroded property tax base. A municipal administration cannot simply legislate away a massive, government-engineered wealth gap with a local ordinance. ## 2. Structural Disadvantage vs. Behavioral Narratives Attempts to deflect from systemic white supremacy by pointing to family structure, culture, or behavioral patterns ignore the root causes that drive those very conditions. * **Concentrated Disadvantage is Policy-Driven:** High homicide and violent crime rates do not exist in a vacuum. Sociological and criminological data consistently show that when you control for deep-rooted structural factors—concentrated poverty, geographic isolation, and the systematic destruction of the economic floor—the racial gap in violent offending behaves the same way regardless of city leadership. * **The Legacy of Economic Extraction:** The socioeconomic environment of FBA Freedmen (Foundational Black Americans)—defined strictly as descendants of Africans chattel-enslaved in the United States—is a direct artifact of historical harms. The survival-based criminality and localized violence seen in abandoned urban centers are predictable symptoms of multi-generational economic deprivation, not an inherent cultural trait. ## 3. Flawed Comparisons with Immigrant Subgroups Comparing the socioeconomic or behavioral outcomes of voluntary immigrant subgroups (such as West African immigrants) to FBA Freedmen is a false equivalency that ignores distinct legal and historical realities. * **Selection Bias:** Voluntary immigrants are highly selected cohorts who often arrive with educational credentials, financial capital, or institutional support systems. * **The Unique Lineage of Harm:** FBA Freedmen carry the cumulative, unmitigated compounding effects of 246 years of chattel slavery, followed by Black Codes, Jim Crow, and ongoing state-sanctioned asset extraction. Immigrant groups do not inherit the specific, localized legacy of American state-enacted segregation and wealth denial. ## The Path to Structural Remedy Using crime data to absolve the federal and state governments of their massive liability to Legacy Black Americans is a classic bad-faith distraction. The statistics do not prove that systemic racism vanishes under Black political representation; rather, they prove that surface-level representation is completely inadequate for fixing deep structural devastation. The only viable remedy to correct this multi-generational economic confinement is comprehensive, targeted federal legislation. This is why the movement actively promotes the **FBA Freedmen Protection and Preservation Act (FPPA)** to establish concrete protections, institutional oversight, and systemic rectification for verified descendants.

This argument completely misinterprets how systemic white supremacy operates, using raw arrest data as a shield to ignore structural realities. When you look at the actual data, the argument that Black political leadership or a high Black population share somehow erases the institutional legacy of white supremacy falls flat. Here is what the statistical and structural data actually shows regarding violent crime, arrests, and institutional control. ## The Illusion of Control: Black Leadership vs. Systemic Machinery The core flaw in the detractor's argument is the assumption that having a Black mayor, a Black police chief, or a Black prosecutor means the system itself has been fundamentally altered. It hasn’t. * **Statistically Consistent Patterns:** Study after study shows that Black per capita violent crime and arrest rates remain consistently elevated across the country, regardless of whether a city is led by White or Black administration. * **Structural Roots Over Representation:** Criminological data demonstrates that when you control for deep-rooted structural factors—such as hyper-segregation, generational poverty, concentrated disadvantage, and historical redlining—the racial gap in violent offending behaves the same way everywhere. A Black face in a high place does not instantly dissolve a century of redlining, the destruction of the FBA economic floor, or the multi-generational trauma inflicted by Jim Crow and its modern iterations. The machinery of the American municipal system was built on white supremacist economic and spatial architecture; changing the operator of the machine does not change what the machine was engineered to do. ## Criminological Reality: The Proxy of Systemic Harms The activist's argument that the vast majority of criminality stems from systemic white supremacy is firmly supported by the data when you understand *why* those numbers are elevated: * **Socioeconomic Enclosure:** High homicide victimization rates (21–27 per 100k) do not exist in a vacuum. They are directly concentrated in neighborhoods characterized by extreme economic abandonment. * **The Blueprint of Segregation:** Black-led cities like Detroit, Baltimore, or New Orleans inherit decades of municipal disinvestment, systemic job loss, and property tax base erosion. Black leadership cannot simply legislate away a massive racial wealth gap with a mayoral decree. * **Environmental and Institutional Traps:** The data proves that crime is a symptom of conditions, not culture or lineage. Because white supremacy historically and systematically drove FBA Freedmen into concentrated pockets of poverty, the resulting survival-based criminality and localized violence are direct legacy products of that oppression. ## The Bottom Line Attributing crime rates to "Black control" is a classic bad-faith distraction. It attempts to absolve the federal and state governments of their massive financial and moral liability to FBA Freedmen. The statistics do not prove that systemic racism is absent under Black leadership; rather, they prove that the economic extraction and structural confinement of Legacy Black Americans are so profound that surface-level political representation cannot fix them. This is precisely why symbolic gestures and political positions are completely inadequate. The only structural remedy to repair this multi-generational economic and social devastation is a comprehensive, federal legislative package: **Reparations for FBA Freedmen.**

Baltimore's historic health gains in recent years are overcoming a harsh legacy of job losses from the retreat of manufacturing, legalized segregation, and racist redlining that crushed opportunities in the heart of the city. heyor.ca/HN3FiI

White flight started long before black people could have any effect on the things you list. Redlining happened before that. You have far too simple an understanding of this whole topic, I'm afraid. There are lots of materials that can catch you up, if you're actually interested.